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War1ock |
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Gnosti Seauton |
Re: Question | #1 | ||
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"Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the law"
Hmmmm..... thats a good question and worthy of an equally good answer. Each and every Thelemite is expected to cut their own way through the jungle, now this doesn't mean they can't ask questions on esoteric sciences, the qaballah and other such subjects. However they are urged not to discuss the BOL. This serves multiple purpose's A: to limit and eventually put an end to priest craft and imposing one own views onto someone else. B: To allow the Thelemite to gain their own relation with the book with out any implanted notions of what it means. In the same passage as the exsert we find it says Quote:So from this statment we can see how each Thelemite can have there questions to the Law answered with out making a center of pestilence out of themselves and someone else " .... by appeal of my writtings each for himself" I have also noticed that with more and more time the book of the law begins to explain itself and revieling itself to those worthy of seeing the answers. So to answer your question of how to retreive information on the BOL. My advice (for whatever it's worth) is to study the other holy books (class A publications) as well as other OTO published and non-published documents also a study of other scriptures (ie... the Tao te Ching, The upanishads, The Bagivad Gitta etc.. etc..) And just keeping an open mind and the secrets will infold each in there turn. I hope that answered your question "Love is the law love under will" ![]() |
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War1ock |
Re: Question | #2 | ||
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Again another great reply
But one thing i do wonder on this subject, although I can see how each thelemite has a journey to embark on, as do we all throughout the course of our lives, religious practices and learning of any sort can lead to misinterpretation by the practitioner. What I mean by this, is if for instance you take the parables of the bible, each person who reads them can take away a different message, all differing from the intended message/practice that the writer designed them to see. Now using Thelema as an example, and the practices therein can lead to the use of higher magicks, could this not be a very dangerous thing to allow? And if you add the concept "Do what thou wilt, shall be the whole of the law", someone who embarks on his journey of discovery with the thought in mind that he need not seek the wisdom of his peers as the knowledge he seeks must be found alone, could walk a very darkened path, should he misinterpret his own desires? Just a thought |
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Gnosti Seauton |
Re: Question | #3 | ||
Quote: LOL thanks. Quote: Very interesting point you bring up here, and it's one at the center of alot of contorversy. But I may have a retort to this point. First off we have to look at the nature of the journey in which leads us to these books and coming to the conclusions that we do about any one thing at any given moment. Now anyone who has knawed and torn and struggled thier way through the jungle we call a "path" knows that a spiritual journey is very personal and becuase it's personal each person will walk away with a different interpretation of any given book because they each live different lives, had different experiences, Differences in background and so forth and so on. These are the things which contribute to our decision making and like wise our preception of the universe and as such contribute to our interpretation of the aforesaid book/parable. The Divine mind/ the higherslef/ god/goddess/ or whatever you want to call it, surely would have realised this when inspiring the scripture/s. So what you and I call misinterpretation it is only such in our own personal journey. Another thing is that knowledge of any nature leads to a better understanding of itself and there for evolves along with the person containing that knowledge. So a person can look at a certain parable, come to some conclusion of it's meaning then come back a few years later to that same parable and it reveal itself to have a completely different meaning but most of the time coinciding with the original interpretation but sometimes completely throwing the first interpretation out of the house. In this way wisodm has a way of presenting itself against the lower ego of the person some what against there personal will (different from True will). Quote: Yes if the True will were to allow the practioneer to do harm with or even be able to accomplish the High Magickal arts need to do the damage. But we must realize that if the person sets out to do damage and it be not in his/her true will then it cannot come into fruitation. High magick has a tendency to protect itself from misuse by the profane. Try getting a person of less than noble character to evoke a Goetic figure if it does appear it will simply tease them or simply wont show up at all. "if the "will" of the prationeer be not of the purest soil then the trees which grow there shall bear no fruit and shall be as the dry stick without the rose"-me Quote: Indeed this is very very true and many self proclaimed Thelemites have gone down that road. However if the proclaimed Thelemite does his/her curriculum this will eventually iron itself out and he/she will realise the errors of their ways (which weren't errors because they led to a better understanding so therefore simply pieces of the puzzle). If not the universe has ways of weading those ppl out of her nest or at least binding them to do no harm. Sorry for the length of this post. ![]() |
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War1ock |
Re: Question | #4 | ||
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As much as we have the will to learn and gain knowledge and the will to share that knowledge....those who we might share that which we have strived so hard to aquire through experience and personal growth, do not always see that information as anything they either need or have to adhere to. This is true in the saying "You can lead a horse to water, but you cant make him drink" Everyone has the conscious choice of how they acquire knowledge, and what Path etc they follow through the course of their lives, and as you so rightly said, someone who for instance read the parables, would indeed come back several years later to read it again, to find that the information contained therein, reads completely different to how it read those years earlier simply due to personal growth or perception. But over the genererations however, the way in which we learn has developed a flaw, that being the information becomes diluted, and tangents from the original branch off to the point were the original teachings are not contained. My example to this might be the martial arts....as the teachings have been handed down from teacher to student, something has always been left out, this is seen in the sense that even thought the student may be competent enough to go on to teach his own students, he is still the student in his teachers eyes as the teacher continues to learn from his own teacher and so on. thus the dilution begins, but if we are teaching ourselves the mysteries of the ancients, that dilution can increase tenfold as we input our own personal thoughts onto the original teachings and remove that which does not appeal to our own sensibilties or that which we feel does not apply. So no guidelines are formed, and the nature of the universe is that for everything good, there is something equally as evil waiting in the wings, or to put another way, for every stopper that the universe puts in the bottle of wisdom to stop someone with ill intent gaining that wisdom, there will be a corkscrew sitting there ready to unlock it. This I guess is as true for Thelema as Wicca as any other practice that can involve the use of Magicks, yet still so many find their way alone, misinterpreting the knowledge they gain along the way and forming divisions at every turn........shame really |
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Gnosti Seauton |
Re: Question | #5 | ||
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I see where you're coming from but there's a factor infinite that you're leaving out and thats divinely inspired knowldge or intution. In this way does the lost teachings of the ancients come into light. And as a Thelemite we are encouraged to put every peice of knowledge to a logical test to see if that truth holds water. We are never to accept anything we see or hear unless it is tested and shows to be true through those tests. The instruments we use to test this knowledge are the qabalah, math, science, and everyday experience.
But then who makes the laws of the sciences. Surely not man and so we come full circle to a point where logic and reason are no longer applicable and we must rely on faith. ![]() |
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War1ock |
Re: Question | #6 | ||
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And therin we trust that our intuition or Divinely inspired knowledge as you say, must come from spirit or similar sources, and those without faith would never believe in spirit, which takes us back to logic and reason.......lol
"Trust in that which you can see and touch But do not always trust in that which you can only hear for sometimes the very air itself is manipulated by forces unknown To give the False impression of truth and wisdom" Warlock 2003 |
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Gnosti Seauton |
Re: Question | #7 | ||
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Ahhh.... actually I've found that those ppl who claim not to believe actually believe more than you or I. But somehow they have become bitter with the divine presence and feel cheated by it (this isn't really their fault it's the fault of a society which see it's god as this Big Vapourous man in the sky condemning everyone to hell) And end up holding a grudge and what better way to spit in the face of a god then to deny it's existence. So they do so and hide behind a mask of reason and logic and scepticism, but it's false scepticism becuase they are already decided towards the other end of the spectrum, they have not put it to tests and the tests the do out it to are biased. A true sceptic would not be decided one way or another towards any subject until he has put it to an unbiased test but even the true sceptic knows that there is always a point where reason and logic hold no water and then he must rely on simply saying "it is that". So those ppl that you're saying don't beieve and never will I will have to disagree with you and say they believe more than they let on. Bringing us back to FAITH.
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War1ock |
Re: Question | #8 | ||
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LOL........ aint differences of opinion great
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